I’m angry for me, and the sisterhood.

Previous Post | I was so angry I was shaking. I sent Jack a text that said “You’re back on POF? Wow.” Not surprisingly, he didn’t reply.

I tried to call him twice – once right after my text. and then at night. I’d looked at POF again and saw he’d been active again just a few hours prior. So he had time to be on the site but not reply. Before bed, I sent a text that said “Call me

Before bed, I sent a text that said “Call me back please. This isn’t the time to play fucking games with me.” I knew he used non-responses as control and I was having none of it.

The next morning I woke up to a text he’d sent past midnight saying he’d just gotten home after a long drive and he would call me tomorrow.

When I got into the office I realized I only had two slots when I was free, so I texted “Now works, or between 12-1.” A few minutes later my phone rang.

“Hello,” he said.

“Hello,” I replied, pausing since I thought he’d launch into whatever he had to say.

“Good morning.”

I didn’t say anything.

“Ann, what’s going on with you? What is your problem?” he said.

Wait. What the fuck?

“Are you fucking kidding me?” I said.

The conversation didn’t get better.

I said, “you’re back on plenty of fish!?” to which he replied “I’m allowed to do what I want to do. I’m not tied to you and I don’t owe you an explanation.”

I was as close to speechless as I can get. Of course he can do whatever he wants, I told him, but had he forgotten our conversation about his a) letting me know when he decided to online date again and b) how he said I’d be his first call when he was ready?

He switched excuse tactics. “I’m filling time when I’m lonely. This is me filling time when I’m lonely.”

“But you haven’t updated your profile! You say you are looking for a relationship which last I checked is something you are clearly not ready for!” He was defensive, saying he “just” used his former profile. “But you’re trolling the internet and talking to others and perhaps dating under false pretenses! Yes! I care about my sisterhood.”

His defense was he doesn’t get much attention online. I said it didn’t matter if even one woman fell for it – like I had – he could end up hurting someone who thought he was negotiating in good faith. He believed the lies he told himself when he was online meeting me, but now he knew he wasn’t ready and was doing it anyway. I told him there were far better places online for him to get an ego boost or whatever the fuck he was doing. He said he had no idea what he was talking about.

He was so goddamn condescending: “Look you are a big girl, I don’t understand why this is a problem”.  I told him I understood more than he gave me credit for and he could have been honest with me about why he was going back online. I chastised him for asking for exclusivity right away (“But that’s just what I need, Ann”) and for not even considering more casually dating while he worked through things. I told him he could have even asked me if I’d be willing to just have a casual physical relationship (don’t worry, I wouldn’t have done that but was just making a point).

I told him I put my big girl panties on every day, thank you very much, but I was astounded at his lies and lack of courtesy.

He was so goddamn condescending: “oh, I didn’t think you’d be waiting for me.”

I laughed, thinking of the three new men I’d met in the last three weeks. “Jack” I said, “I never said I was waiting for you. I haven’t been waiting for you. But you just don’t forget the kind of connection we had.”

He changed course again. “Ann I’m sorry if I hurt you. But I’m trying to not jump off a bridge right now. I’m trying to heal and deal with this. I need to get myself together before the kids come home from their trip next week.”

I suggested given how messed up he said he was, he wasn’t going to get over in it a week. He said he was desperate to get back with his ex-girlfriend and she wanted nothing to do with him. It drove him crazy thinking she was fucking someone else. He said he knew perhaps it wasn’t the best relationship for him, but he didn’t care.

I told him this called into question everything he told me about our connection, because if his head was so far up his own ass that he could look at me across the dinner table on our first date and swear it was over, then how could he even know how he felt about me? I choked up when I reminded him I’d told him that night how important it was for me to be with someone who was done with their past relationship, given my heartbreak with Tony.

“What you feel is not my concern right now. I’m trying to not be depressed. I’m trying to heal any way I can and it’s one hundred percent about me.”

I don’t remember all of the things I said in this conversation. I may come back and add things we said as I remember them. I was angry and said “fuck” a lot. I asked whether it even crossed his mind that I would see him online. He said he was surprised I would even have noticed or cared. He said he figured I’d forgotten about him because we’d been apart longer than we’d been together (not true). We’d talked not one week prior!

I also got emotional asking him how he could possibly think I would have forgotten about him, given what I told him about the connection I felt we had. I said I believed him when he told me that connection was two-sided and believed him when he said all the great things about me and our chemistry. I asked whether all of it was a lie. He said no, but the damage had been done. I realized – and said – he was likely projecting when he said he assumed I’d forgotten about him.

Because clearly, despite everything, he’d forgotten about me.

19 thoughts on “I’m angry for me, and the sisterhood.

  1. I wouldn’t have even called him. If he was back online dating, that would have told me all I needed to know. I will tell you that I, for one, knew he was lying to you about many of his excuses and things he’d told you. This guy not only lies a lot with a straight face, he also doesn’t care about how he’s lying. I can tell you, in my profession I have heard more POF stories than I’d care to talk about. And no, I have not heard the same for the pay dating sites.

    • I’m curious what you think he lied to me about?
      Lies require deliberate intent. When I first met him I think he truly meant what he said to me… but I’m interested in how you see it differently.

      • Honestly Ann, besides meeting you for sex, I think he lied about everything else. His mother in the hospital, his “moving out, the woman her referred to as an “ex,” ” etc, etc… I believe that you even felt some of the red flags, but chose to ignore them. Go back and read some of your posts about Jack. Just be grateful he’s out of your life. You do deserve much better than a pathological liar.

        • Oceans I can tell you with 100% certainty he was not lying about his mother, and he was not lying about moving out, and the breakup with his girlfriend. These were independently verified. I didn’t ignore anything – I wrote about my doubt in what he said about his relationship with his ex girlfriend. However I was also in a long term relationship that was completely emotionally done before I moved out – so I know it’s possible.
          I genuinely think he wanted to believe the things he told me about their relationship, and about our nascent one. He is too egotistical, selfish, and controlling to have been able to face the truth – that he was seriously butt-hurt that she ended it. When he told me she’d called he cops on him I said “there’s a lot of anger there” which he denied vehemently. He couldn’t see it. But then after he moved out his anger faded, he couldn’t ignore the other emotions. Absolutely he’s a liar – he proved that capability with his past relationships – and by going back online and presenting as someone who wants a relationship he’s got no excuse anymore. Before at least he may not have known he wasn’t ready, but he sure does now.

  2. ((hugs))

    Reading this made me tear up a little. He and G sound just the same. Because I don’t get much (any) attention normally, I try to be cautious with assuming connections or reading too much into words…sometimes to the point of being too cautious and appearing too cool…but this time was different. Or so it felt and so he said AND acted. Until he didn’t. Now I have to wonder how much, if any, was real and realize it sucks that my final foray into dating had to end like this (again).

    OK, ((more hugs)).

    • Good grief, can I be any more me-me-me with that comment? This is what happens when you don’t have a blog, you hijack comments 😀 Sorry, but hopefully you get that I know how you feel and am here for ya.

  3. “But I’m trying to not jump off a bridge right now.”

    May I suggest a very tall one? (metaphorically speaking that is)

    Do you believe any of this shit? I remember that you said he was a very(?) successful salesman. I know you are an astute judge of people, but…..

    • I think under pressure he says what he thinks he should say. He apologized for hurting me yet also said it’s all about him right now. I don’t think he’s sorry at all but it’s what one says.
      I do believe he’s been completely thrown for a loop in how he’s felt after moving out. He likes control and she was the one that ended it. What he’s described is very much the sting of a rejection and (in his eyes) the premature ending of a relationship he wasn’t happy in but was willing to stay in.
      I can’t speak to whether he’s actually so depressed that he’s contemplating suicide. I’m not an expert. However he has such love and devotion for his children I’d be surprised if its actually true. His various justifications of his behavior in our conversation struck me as someone trying to convince themselves they aren’t a piece of shit. I’ve seen it before where people who do terrible things can’t see themselves as “that person”. So they tell themselves and others whatever they need in order to preserve their identity as someone different.
      I do believe what he told me about how he felt for me – he believed it at the time – but that doesn’t mean with time and reflection it will hold true for him.

  4. Aw, Ann. I’m so sorry. It sucks enough to be broken up with, but then to feel disrespected and lied to afterwards just adds insult to injury. One thing that isn’t fair in these situations, but always seems to happen, is that once you break up and release someone (or have no choice but to release someone) back into their sphere, they are usually going to be much less accountable to you, regardless of what they promise. It’s totally angry-making. You are in your right to be angry, but you know in the pit of your stomach that he is just going to keep doing what he is doing. You can’t control it. You can’t control how he behaves with the sisterhood. (I’ve just watched someone who I still have lots of pain over just pull a woman in deep, use her hard, and eject her… but there’s nothing I can do about it).

    Like Oceans, I felt many red flags about Jack that came from the combination of his intensity and also with all the things you learned, one by one, that were messed up in his life. I agree that he never consciously lied to you, but I guess I’ve been around too many guys like him who burn hard and bright up front, but invariably, they can’t sustain it and find a web of excuses (and life circumstances) to retreat to. My sense, Ann, is that if you were at all holding a candle for him to be available, a guy like Jack will always have a million difficult things to wrestle with that would make him never truly able to prioritize you, that will always give him justification to act purely out of self-interest. He sounds like a guy who, when his defenses are down, retreats to the realm of self-pity, and you don’t need a guy like that. I guess I speak too painfully from experience. In a sense, it is a blessing to catch him in such a blatant act of selfishness and misrepresentation. You have the power now, to truly let him go.

    Jack has made it clear from this conversation that he is incapable of respecting you, so you don’t have to beat this dead horse anymore. He just can’t do it. It’s a royal bummer. Hopefully once the sting of this fades, you’ll wake up feeling a little more available for the next opportunity. We’re rooting for you!

  5. My dear, sweet Ann, do you not know how some of us play the game? See, this is a good example of why a guy like me wouldn’t stand a chance with a woman like you because some clown’s idea of handling his business is to fuck with a woman’s mind and feelings – then fuck her – then go on about his business and as if she never existed. A woman have this happen to her more than once and that raises her shields and puts her on high alert against such a thing happening again – and us decent guys wind up paying for it because she will instinctively not trust anything a man – any man – tells her.

    Can’t say that I blame you for being pissed but, ah, shit, you know me: I’m gonna tell you that without any doubts about it, there are some men who will only give a fuck about you for as long as they can get at your coochie and when they’ve had their fill of you, you’re history – and on to the next woman.

    You see, we know that women are really funny about who they give themselves to and when we can totally and completely break down their barriers and take them, well, for some guys, it’s a badge of honor and a major accomplishment since, as I said, y’all ain’t easy to have sex with… unless we can find a way to completely disarm your self-protection mode. And at the risk of having my man card revoked, yes: We will do and say anything that will get us between your legs.

    My question to you – and because you know that I love enticing you to think – is how will this experience affect you going forward?

  6. I certainly can relate to what you say Kdaddy23 about not trusting again! I’ve been played WAY too many times! But.. there’s still a bit of my heart that wants to trust and that will when I know I can let down my own guard. I certainly hope so anyway.

    Good riddance to Jack!! He’s got his head up his ass SO far that he can probably see out of his belly button!
    (I hope that made you giggle Ann)

  7. Well, I must really be a naive bitch because I for one am not positive given Ann’s blog, that he is a total liar. I think he’s messed up and in need of intense therapy, yes. I think he’s deluding himself (as some men do) that the past relationship is salvageable. I’m not sure why he’s still trolling POF (and who knows how many other sites?) for someone to date potentially.

    I will say this. He is free to do as he chooses. Technically, although it’s rude AF, he doesn’t “owe” Ann anything, even though he may/may not have agreed to stay off POF.

    He’s so stupid it makes me cringe! He and Ann had a nice little thing going. They seemed compatible. Why in God’s name wouldn’t he want to try to make every effort for it to work????

    Thought #1: He and the ex gf DID have 5 years history. That’s something. That, in fact, is pretty hard to give up easily. I think guys like consistency in their lives and he apparently has kids to think of, who also thrive on routine.

    Thought #2: Stress makes people do strange things. Have you ever taken that test adding up all the stress-inducing factors in your life? Recent break-up, divorce, illness and/or death in the family, moving, new baby, loss of a job or new job, etc. One of the most stressful times is actually start of a new relationship. It’s an edgy. nervous time. Jack’s numbers are off the chart.

    I’m not forgiving the dude. And yes, he started out like Cary Grant and ended up like Heath Ledger’s Joker with the smiling face. I hope he finds help. I hope he doesn’t hurt anyone else.

  8. He is an asshole – we can all agree on that. Forget about him, forget about trying to teach him a lesson or closure – those are only symptoms of your need to somehow have control of the situation. That’s probably part of the reason you are so angry. He’s a jerk, you didn’t quite catch it until now. You let your guard down, let yourself be vulnerable and he’s another jerk who let you down. All valid reasons to be pissed.

    For some perspective, I heard a great parable yesterday about 2 monks and a prissy Lady. She refused to cross a stream because she didn’t want to get wet. The old monk carried her across (violating some monk taboo causing him dishonor). The young monk fumed and fretted in silence for a couple of miles. He finally burst out – “why did you carry her across the stream?”

    The old monk replied “I only carried her across the stream. Why are you still carrying her?”

  9. So he’s a liar and his ex-girlfriend had to call the police because he apparently became violent when she broke up with him. Can’t imagine why she doesn’t want to get back together with him.

    • Definitely a liar. According to him, she called the police on him right before he moved out. Apparently they had been broken up for 4-5 months but still living under the same roof. They each had their kids living with them so I can understand why it wouldn’t have been a quick move out. But yeah, if he’s that mug of a liar (or all his other stellar qualities) then I can’t blame her.

  10. I’ve long learned that “looking for a relationship” on POF is just code for pretty much anything, but most often “date + sex”. I appreciate you’d stand up for your sisterhood, but I think the sisterhood, especially the ones on POF are as jaded as I and assume that at least 50% of every profile is total bullshit.

    That doesnt make his behavior during his time with you any less selfish and idiotic. I just wouldn’t have bothered reacting so much to the reapparance on POF. He is behaving exactly in line with my expectations of most ppl on POF.

    Thats why I prefer Tinder, even for dating. There is a certain integrity: mainly for hookups + some ppl looking for dating. No pretense. No “I’m gonna pretend to be serious in order to weed out the skanks/hoes/wtv degrading label a guy uses for a certain type of woman he considers beneath him, but really I just want to have fun.” which is almost every guy I’ve ever interacted with on POF was like.

What do you think?